BillyBoy
Member
The best thing before sliced bread was doorstep sarnies
Posts: 33
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Post by BillyBoy on Sept 22, 2017 9:54:10 GMT
HI CHARLIE CAN YOU GIVE US ALL A UPDATE ON THE NEW PROJECT.I BET LIKE ME A LOT OF PEOPLE ON HERE ARE VERY INTRESTED IN OWNING ONE, BILL
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Post by Charlie Hall on Sept 22, 2017 11:56:27 GMT
Hi Bill, Apologies for the delays with the project and thanks to everyone for your continued interest in it. I was told there had been a delay with getting the first prototype circuit board made. Happily this has now been done so I am going to the factory next Wednesday to work with Stephen to build the first prototype for tests. The first prototype will contain two different switchable preamps, a power amp emulator, and a switchable speaker emulator. I am hoping we will have all these working by the time we are done on Wednesday. The actual electronic switching circuits will be added later. Keep in mind this unit will not contain actual EF86 valves or any other valves. It will use solid state components to emulate the sound of the Vox EF86 channel versions known as circuit 2 (Apache, Quatermasster's Stores) and circuit 3 (many other early Shadows hits) in a similar way to how the Hall & Collins Signature Echo emulates the valve preamp sound of the Echomatic 2. Regards, Charlie
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Post by glyderslead on Sept 23, 2017 8:22:56 GMT
Hello Charlie.
I hope you can help with answers to a couple of questions.
Can you let us have an indication of the dimensions of the new unit. I ask because I'm sure many of us will need to re- arrange our Effecs boards. I expect from what has been said about the unit it will really supersede cutting edge boxes and even the excellant Geminii effect box, so you can see the size will be important if one of these units will be replaced and like mine your board is quite cramped. (As you can see, I will be buying one as I have every confidence that your product will not fall short).
Time is important too. I'm sure there are many of us on Chemo' that would like to get a few gigs in with the new unit before we can't . I don't want to pin you down in any way but do you have a " nice if these could be available by about .................if we can" date.
Do you have an indication of what area the price may be. Say a " nice if these could be made available from about £....... to £.......".
Whatever the price, which I am sure will not be cheap, the good thing is that any of the previously noted effects that a buyer has, that become redundant , will become available for a good price to those members that are not able to reach out for the new unit at this time.
Cheers
Mick
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Post by bor64 on Sept 23, 2017 11:15:18 GMT
Hi Charlie,
Apart from the dimensions etc....I'm hoping it will be a 9V so it's usable with lots of powersuplies on many effects boards...
Cheers Rob
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Post by jondonwar on Sept 23, 2017 19:01:29 GMT
I hope its mains powered,
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Post by Charlie Hall on Sept 23, 2017 19:51:09 GMT
Hi Mick, We haven't designed the casing yet so I can't give you dimensions. I can only say I want it to be as small as possible but it will probably be larger than a typical Boss effect pedal. In your words it would be "nice if" we could have it ready by the end of the year. I am hoping we can keep the price under £100.
Hi Rob, It will have a similar 12 volt AC power supply to the Hall & Collins Signature Echo. It has to be AC to get the voltage high enough for the valve emulation circuit.
Hi jondonwar, It will be only mains powered ie. with a separate power supply unit.
Regards, Charlie
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Post by Charlie Hall on Sept 27, 2017 20:45:03 GMT
I went to the factory today to start work building the first proto type with Stephen. After about 1 1/2 hours we had both of the EF86 emulator preamps working as intended although we have not play tested them yet. The power amp was not completed because we were short of some parts and we did not have time today to build the speaker emulator. I will update again when there is more news. Regards, Charlie
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 20, 2017 10:08:22 GMT
For those interested I have an update. I went to the factory this week and we now have the power amp emulator (which includes a cut control) working. As I felt there wasn't enough gain to get the amount of distortion I hoped for, we are now adjusting the gain structure. The power amp emulator soft clips and compresses the sound, and we are getting crossover distortion just like I see when testing AC30 and AC15 output stages. By the way, the presence of crossover distortion is solid proof that AC30s (and AC15s) are not class A power amps. I tried my guitar and H & C echo through it, into a fairly flat response guitar amp (much like the normal channel of an AC30) and the circuit 2 (Apache, Quatermassters Stores) and 3 (The Savage etc.) emulations sound good. The cut control has to be used to warm up the sound when the circuit 3 side is used, and from memory the sound is about the same as the real thing. We will later be making closer comparisons with Vox amps that have real EF86 stages. The next stages of development are to make the component changes to get the gain as we want it, and to build the speaker emulator. Regards, Charlie
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Post by Steve Reynolds on Oct 20, 2017 11:14:56 GMT
sounds an interesting project Charlie. I wish you all the best with it
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 20, 2017 12:11:53 GMT
Thanks Steve, Regards, Charlie
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Post by gruntfuttock on Oct 20, 2017 12:17:06 GMT
Hi Charlie. This is really becoming more and more interesting!! Thanks for the update! I've already "Prepped my wife to expect a new addition to my pedal board!! Regards Dave
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Post by bor64 on Oct 20, 2017 18:24:49 GMT
Hi Charlie ,thanks for the update! Sounds promissing for sure.... Mastercard standby for ordering 3 of these please!
Cheers Rob
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Post by George Lewis on Oct 20, 2017 20:20:14 GMT
Hi Charlie, Certainly sounds interesting. Will the input be suitable for both Hi and Lo impedance ? With the speaker emulator, I assume it be suitable to go straight into a PA ?
Have you thought about what kind of output socket, eg 1/4" and RCA unbalanced ? Will it include a true bypass switch ?
Regards George
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 20, 2017 20:46:47 GMT
Hi Dave, Rob and George, Thanks for your interest in this project.
George, the input will have exactly the same impedances as the EF86 preamps the unit emulates. Circuit 2 preamp has an input impedance of about 400 Kilohms and circuit 3 preamp has an input impedance of 1 Megohm (hi input). These therefore are both high impedance but you can connect units with a low output impedance to them, such as the H & C unit and most other modern effects. Connecting high into low doesn't work well unless it's for a deliberate effect such as with the mismatch that occurs at the input of a Fuzz Face. You get crazy gain boosts with small changes of the guitar volume control with those! The speaker emulator will be suitable for direct connection to a PA or other full range system, or for recording, assuming the emulator works as I want it to. The speaker emulator will have a bypass switch. Not sure yet if it will be a small switch or a footswitch. I have thought about using a true bypass switch but there are disadvantages with doing that, one being the increased total cable length which reduces treble due to increased capacitance, another is the cost of a DPDT footswitch. The alternative to true bypass is to route the internal signal so it always goes through a unity gain amp which would then have a low output impedance. We could have any types of output sockets. Definitely a 1/4" jack (which can be impedance balanced if a TRS jack is used with hot cold and earth connections to a balanced input, otherwise it would be unbalanced if a normal jack is used). I was thinking also of adding a balanced XLR out. Can you give me one or more examples of where an RCA jack out would be useful?
Regards, Charlie
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Post by George Lewis on Oct 20, 2017 22:05:43 GMT
Hi Charlie, The Bose PA I use has RCA stereo, 1/8" stereo and 1/4" guitar/Line inputs and I use the RCA as the feed from a mixer. However, on thinking a bit more I can't really think of any circumstance where RCA from the EF86 emulator would be needed so let's cross that off the list !
A bypass was suggested so that a different emulator could be easily switched in if required but perhaps that could be done external to the emulator pedals. At present I have one multi purpose amp sim pedal with 4 different emulations with varying Amp sim, EQ and compression settings that can be switched between, depending on the tune. No one else notices of course !
regards George
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 20, 2017 22:20:14 GMT
Hi George, Thanks for explaining. I don't see the need for an RCA jack out. I will definitely include a footswitchable bypass. It's just a case of deciding whether it will be passive or active! If I am understanding you correctly either would work for what you have in mind but as I said a true bypass increases the chance of treble loss if longer cables are used in the chain. Regards, Charlie
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Post by George Lewis on Oct 20, 2017 22:50:08 GMT
Hi Charlie, Yes, either should work. Also, perhaps there are already separate external switches that can have multiple pedal inputs but only one active as output at a time. Regards George
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 21, 2017 0:17:06 GMT
Hi George, Not exactly multiple but an A/B switch connected backwards should work to select one of two different inputs to route either to a single output. I don't know if there would be any objectionable switching noises though. Regards, Charlie
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Post by scanners on Oct 21, 2017 3:04:39 GMT
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 21, 2017 10:44:30 GMT
Hi Matthew, Not before but I have now! I didn't like the sound much, possibly because of the Vintage 30 speakers. The reasoning behind having two different EF86 sounds in our preamp is because they sound very different to one another. The valve circuit components are different in each, as well as the tone filtering that comes after each one. Regards, Charlie
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Post by garyallen on Oct 21, 2017 16:22:40 GMT
Hi Charlie,hope all is well,will the pedal have gain and eq knobs/buttons? regards gary
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Post by alanfgb on Oct 21, 2017 17:51:38 GMT
Hi Charlie, These are exciting times similar to when the H&CSE was nearing it's launch date. Please put me on the list for two units. Thanks.
Alan
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 21, 2017 22:06:16 GMT
Hi Gary, Each channel's volume control will act as a gain control. Turning those up will overdrive the power amp emulator. There will be a master volume that comes near the end of the signal chain. I am considering having a brilliance switch on the circuit 3 side, like the original amps had. Setting it to normal would be good for overdrive. Setting it to brilliance cuts a lot of bass.
Hi Alan, Thank you. I have started a list and put you on it.
Regards, Charlie
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Post by agb on Oct 22, 2017 4:51:36 GMT
Hi Charlie Please put me on your list for the EF86 pedal Agb
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Post by carl c on Oct 22, 2017 7:26:04 GMT
Hi Charlie, Not been on much over last few months, Have been going through a few medical procedures. Glad I noticed your new development " EF86 Project". Can you put me on your list Thank you. In a few weeks time hoping to get my new hip. Best Regards Carl.
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streetboy
Member
As long as you know what's upside, down, inside and out you're on the right path
Posts: 153
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Post by streetboy on Oct 22, 2017 8:28:55 GMT
Hi Gary, Each channel's volume control will act as a gain control. Turning those up will overdrive the power amp emulator. There will be a master volume that comes near the end of the signal chain. I am considering having a brilliance switch on the circuit 3 side, like the original amps had. Setting it to normal would be good for overdrive. Setting it to brilliance cuts a lot of bass. Hi Alan, Thank you. I have started a list and put you on it. Regards, Charlie Hi Charlie, Please add me to the list as well. rgds Soren
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Post by glyderslead on Oct 22, 2017 9:17:24 GMT
Hello Charlie,
This thread is certainly taking off which I am sure will lead to many members, and other as the word goes around, buying this unique effects unit. I certainly wish you well in this venture.
I don’t profess to understanding much of the technical comments above, regarding the various switching options, knobs and buttons for this and that which might be used in a recording situation; but I hope the new unit is easily connected between an H&CSE and an amp, with simple guidance regarding suggested settings for both the unit and the amp.
please add me to the list.
Cheers and good wishes
Mick
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BillyBoy
Member
The best thing before sliced bread was doorstep sarnies
Posts: 33
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Post by BillyBoy on Oct 22, 2017 9:19:01 GMT
can you put me on the list for first batch please Charlie best regards bill
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Post by Charlie Hall on Oct 22, 2017 11:24:33 GMT
Hi Agb, Carl, Soren, Mick, and Bill, Thanks for your interest in the unit. I have added you all to the list.
Carl, best of luck with the new hip.
Mick, The unit will be as easy as any other pedal. Connection to an amp will be with a normal jack to jack cable.
Regards, Charli
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Post by gruntfuttock on Oct 22, 2017 14:13:23 GMT
Hi Charlie. Thanks for the additional info. Please put me on your list of definite buyers. Regards Dave
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