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Post by shawbridge on Feb 23, 2020 16:48:49 GMT
Hi Peter, I think according to the H&C, the Setting for the Snowman, is one that uses the effects created by two Roland301 units if that’s wrong, I hold my hands up to be corrected. Peter
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Post by Charlie Hall on Feb 23, 2020 17:26:25 GMT
It is understood that on The Snowman there was an echo signal on the left channel and a slightly longer echo signal on the right channel. The delays sort of match up fairly well with the RE-301 except that the delays even on the left channel are a little slower than the slowest speed the RE-301 should be capable of. The echo was almost certainly added after the lead guitar part was recorded so there could have been a number of different ways of achieving the effect. Regards, Charlie
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Post by barryjh on Feb 23, 2020 20:28:39 GMT
Maybe Dick Plant has the answer to this and other recording methods regarding Hanks recorded sounds. Not sure he subscribes to these forums though.
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Post by glyderslead on Feb 24, 2020 11:04:33 GMT
With all this tinkering to the recorded sound I guess Hank has just as much of a problem as we have in trying to achieve “his” sound!
Cheers
Mick
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Post by peterbower on Feb 25, 2020 8:53:38 GMT
I remember years ago Hank saying he wished he could replicate his original sound and Echo, I think it was this that spurred Charlie on to develop EFTP which Hank ended up using, he mentioned Charlie in one interview praising the echo that Charlie had developed, I think I got that right if not Charlie can correct it
Pete
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Post by brightcaster on May 4, 2020 7:27:09 GMT
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Post by bor64 on May 5, 2020 5:45:37 GMT
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Post by bor64 on May 5, 2020 16:02:19 GMT
Hi Val, The Elyea book... I ordered 3 of those...I can vividly remember the postman and his hand-truck entering my street Pity there will be no second one, big money lured Jim away...to write other things. Speaking of a book, when is yours available? Please tell me more about it. Cheers Rob
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Post by sheendigs on May 7, 2020 14:34:21 GMT
Hi Rob After having looked at those wonderful pictures, can we say that the first VOX disk-echo was made by FRAMEZ for their brand? SHeendigs
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Post by bor64 on May 7, 2020 21:03:51 GMT
Hi Sheendigs,
Yes indeed, Meazzi made nothing themself, everything they sold...was build by others. I'm sure when you google translate site, you'll be surprised how many sub-contract manufacturers and suppliers they used. A lot was made in the same county, even big name brands were involved.
Cheers Rob
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Post by sheendigs on May 9, 2020 1:06:16 GMT
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Post by sheendigs on May 9, 2020 10:05:54 GMT
Hi Val Now that I look at the Wheel of the VOX or Echomatic Model J, I can see clearly the Rubber loop around the circumference of the wheel. Thanks for pinpointing that. Sheendigs
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Post by sheendigs on May 9, 2020 10:24:58 GMT
Since we are on the subject Type Ecco-Fonic in Google and see the kind of balanced wheels they had at that time. Very interesting unit Sheendigs
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Post by bor64 on May 9, 2020 16:35:42 GMT
Hi Val,
Have you ever seen a original Framez drum echo in the flesh? The 1/2 inch tape on the drum is hold in place by double-sided adhesive-tape and some oil for the needed lubricant.
Cheers Rob
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Post by bazmusicman on May 10, 2020 10:03:56 GMT
Hi Rob, I've never seen a Framez or some of the Vox echos in real life. Only knew about them from them early Shadows days. I didn't even know the tape was half inch wide. Wonder how they mounted the tape in the very early days, would they have had double sided tape?. God, I have enough trouble just changing the tape loop in my Klemt Echolette, imagine trying to fit a loop around the Meazzi's etc, double sided tape would certainly make it easier. I think Binson solved the problem with their drum. Regards val I remember reading that Hank used to stick the tape on the drum with Vaseline.
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Post by philc on May 15, 2020 8:24:39 GMT
My old Bell Catalogue where I bought my first electric guitar the Rapier 33, check out the Copycat.
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Post by peterbower on May 15, 2020 15:04:18 GMT
I believe Fender even brought out a drum echo at one period but it was never successful,. not sure of the details, perhaps some body could tell us
Peter
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Post by poppastarr on May 16, 2020 1:12:58 GMT
HI Phil
Great catalogue page, check out the prices, probably cheap for today but not yesteryear.
Regards
Val
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Post by Charlie Hall on May 16, 2020 13:33:06 GMT
Hi Val, Binson echo units always had the heads in contact with the drum as far as I have seen with the many units I have come across. The instruction manual detailed how to clean the surfaces and re-oil them. Binson even supplied a bottle of oil with each unit for the purpose. I even had the specs for the tension of the heads at one time, specified in grams. It was either 2 or 3 grams for the record head, and 1 1/2 or 2 grams for the playback heads. Sorry, I have forgotten the exact figures. Worn drums would be very noisy. I had one which I replaced with a brand new drum and the unit became very quiet after that. Regards, Charlie
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Post by scanners on May 17, 2020 1:25:18 GMT
Cool seeing that old catalogue does the Watkins copycat sound like the Meazzi ? Matthew
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Post by poppastarr on May 17, 2020 4:17:06 GMT
Hi Charlie,
Well I'll be darned, can't always believe what you read on the net, but one never stops learning . Thank you very much for the clarification. I can now see why the worn surfaces had to be rethreaded or resurfaced.
Most appreciated, a re-write required now on the Binson pages.
PS: I'm Still using that fabulous H&C echo as my main unit.
Regards
Val
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Post by Charlie Hall on May 17, 2020 7:43:51 GMT
Cool seeing that old catalogue does the Watkins copycat sound like the Meazzi ? Matthew My first echo unit was a very early Copicat probably made in 1958. I can assure you it was not capable of sounding anything like any Meazzi. It couldn't get any of the echo sounds I wanted at the time. Regards, Charlie
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Post by shawbridge on May 17, 2020 7:49:25 GMT
Hi Mathew, The Copycat, definatly not like a Meazzi. The Cooycat was what most of us used in Clubland back in the 60s & 70s, you always got that clickety click with them, I Used both the valve version and solid state silver top by Wem. In my opinion the valve version sounded better to my ears but perhaps the later model more reliable. I did an A&B comparison test with the Watkins copycat and Magicstomp with EFTP, the Magicstomp way way way ..... better, more convincing, in my opinion. Peter
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Post by andyj47 on May 17, 2020 8:53:51 GMT
at the time, getting your first copycat ,...……….boy you thought you was hank !!!
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Post by bazmusicman on May 17, 2020 9:55:51 GMT
Hi Mathew, The Copycat, definatly not like a Meazzi. The Cooycat was what most of us used in Clubland back in the 60s & 70s, you always got that clickety click with them, I Used both the valve version and solid state silver top by Wem. In my opinion the valve version sounded better to my ears but perhaps the later model more reliable. I did an A&B comparison test with the Watkins copycat and Magicstomp with EFTP, the Magicstomp way way way ..... better, more convincing, in my opinion. Peter Hi Peter, The valve version of the Copycat is much warmer and better sounding than the solid state version. I still have a Mk2 valve Copycat and a solid state IC400 with a variable speed control.
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Post by shawbridge on May 23, 2020 22:26:56 GMT
Hi Baz, Nice to hear from you, I hope you are keeping well. Yes, I definatly like the valve version but the one I used was getting rather old and was a bit noisy as a result, so had to use the silver solid state wem copycat. Copycat’s behaved themselves if you kept the heads clean, they soon got mucky and the tapes wore out too.
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Post by shawbridge on May 23, 2020 22:29:43 GMT
Hi Andy, Agree, until you put the shads record on then you were back to square1 😂 Very frustrating back in copycat days, most folks fell for it but real shads fans who knew the sound ‘ahh it’s not quite the sound mate but it’s passable’ Peter
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Post by bazmusicman on May 24, 2020 9:45:39 GMT
Hi Baz, Nice to hear from you, I hope you are keeping well. Yes, I definatly like the valve version but the one I used was getting rather old and was a bit noisy as a result, so had to use the silver solid state wem copycat. Copycat’s behaved themselves if you kept the heads clean, they soon got mucky and the tapes wore out too. Hi Peter, Nice to hear from you and I trust the AC30 is giving you good service. Back in about 1980/81 I took my valve Copycat up to WEM's factory at the Oval in London where John Truba the Company Tech replaced all the heads and switches, input sockets etc while I was there watching so it ran as good as new. I still have all the old replaced parts. Yes you have to keep it maintained, head cleaning etc. Regards, Baz.
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Post by shawbridge on May 27, 2020 22:32:56 GMT
Hi Baz, It’s a great feeling to have something restored like that, yes the AC30 is giving Stirling service but a while sinceI last used it in earnest, re lockdown, myself and the Band can’t wait to get together as soon as we get the all clear. Are you still playing the guitar? Rgds Peter
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Post by bazmusicman on May 28, 2020 8:38:09 GMT
Hi Peter,
Glad to hear the Amp is serving you well.
Yes I bet you are 'champing at the bit' to get playing again....it gets a bit frustrating sitting about wanting to 'get going'.
I am still playing guitar at home with my dodgy hands, also playing more on my Lap Slide guitar at the moment because it's easier on my fingers.
Next week I will receive the Double Neck Pedal Steel Guitar that I had made for me because I am left handed. It's took 7 1/2 months to build, that should be interesting trying to play that!
Best regards, Baz.
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