Right or Left Handed a Question

[ha2he]

Hi Charlie & Friends,

I saw the subject touched upon briefly in another thread so I thought it might be time to expand on it.

I'm sure Charlie has mentioned being a lefty when it comes to writing but plays guitar right handed.
Many years ago I had a friend who played bass (a lefty) and we were fooling around with some tunes, he said to me 'can I try your guitar' (I'm a righty), of course, and we swapped instruments. I fumbled about and he played guitar with not a problem, I should add he did have a lefty guitar too. I was amazed how easily he made the switch.

So, I'm sure we all know the turn it over and re-string it like Jimi Hendrix routine, but I was watching a guy a few years ago and he had me totally thrown, a fella called Doyle Bramhall, he had it strung with the bass strings towards his feet, took a while for me to figure, chord work looked very complicated indeed, he seemed O.K. with it though.

Ronnie O'Sullivan ( Snooker ) can play equally well left or right handed which leads me nicely to my question......

Does anyone know the name of the theme tune to the snooker program, I'm not sure if it's the current one but it used to be a guitar based tune..........

Sorry 'bout the rambling.
Thanks in advance,
Tim.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Tim,
I heard that Jimi Hendrix once picked up a right handed guitar and played it right handed, and surprisingly well.
I have never been able to play left handed.
The guitarist on the snooker theme is Geoff Whitehorn. I have not been able to find the title.
Regards,
Charlie

[ha2he]

Hi Charlie,
Thanks for that info. I'll see what I can find.
I heard that about Jimi too, must say I'm not really that surprised.
It took me a while to pick up on the Doyle Bramhall thing as you can imagine, how do you end up learning to play like that!

Just found some youtube clips of the snooker tune and it looks like it's called either Drag Racer or Dragster. Guess I should have looked there first.

Regards,
Tim.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Tim,
Junior Campbell of Marmalade played left handed on a right handed guitar upside down. He also tuned the strings to an open E chord. The strings were not reversed, so he was also playing with the bass strings lower and the treble strings closest to him.
I first saw him play with a Gibson ES345, then later he changed to a Strat. He used a Vox AC100 head and 1, and later, 2 Beatle cabs. It was a huge sound. There were 2 bass players, Graham Knight played conventionally on a Fender Jazz Bass, and Pat Fairley played a Danelectro 6 string bass tuned to EAE in octaves, similar to the pairs on a 12 string. Marmalade were always a very loud band and I have never heard another band that had a similar sound, because of the way the 2 guitars were tuned. Apparently even Jimi Hendrix was a fan. The hits did not do justice to their live sound. I saw them many times and it always sounded the same, excellent. The nearest recording to that live sound was their version of Hey Joe, one of their last recordings before they got to number one with Lovin' Things. Most of their hits sound like they had session musicians playing on them.
From what Junior told me when I asked him at the time, he just picked up a right handed guitar, tuned it to an open E chord, turned it upside down and learned to play it like that.
Regards,
Charlie

[ha2he]

Hi Charlie,
What an absolute wealth of information you are. Nice little stroll down memory lane I've had, found the version of Hey Joe by Marmalade on youtube and despite a poor recording it does sound like a good version. Did you see them as a spectator or in a professional capacity? If Jimi was a fan they must have been up to scratch!

It's a strange sensation when what you're watching doesn't match what you're hearing, the upside down guitar thing, took me a while to figure it out.

Having watched Drag Racer played on youtube and spent a little time giving it a go, it's a nice little number to play. I've got about 75% of it O.K. in a short space of time, any ideas why some numbers just seem to fall out of your hands and others are a pig?

Regards,
Tim.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Tim,
It wasn't in a professional capacity at all. I was more trying to learn why they sounded so good. I just used to go and see them play wherever it was convenient to me. I did travel some distances sometimes. They often played local to my area before they hit it big. Even in a small hall it was a great atmosphere and sound.
Here's another I had fogotten about:
uk.youtube.com/watch?v=UCn61DuBrgo

[Charlie Hall]

And here's another performance, a cover of The Who's I Can't Explain, probably recorded at BBC studios for a radio broadcast. Listen to the depth when the stop occurs at 1.47, probably the combination of the lead guitar and 6 string bass. The live sound was like that almost all of the time. It changed when Junior Campbell left and was replaced by Hughie Nicholson, possibly also because Pat Fairley changed from playing the 6 string bass to normal rhythm guitar at the same time. I saw them live like that once and never bothered to go to see them again.
uk.youtube.com/watch?v=61zHUG7yF6g&feature=related

[ha2he]

Hi Charlie,

I have to agree that is a unique sound and can see given the opportunity why you would wish to see them live.

The 'I see the rain' track sounds very nice indeed and has some good guitar playing, also shows quite well the upside down guitar.
At 0:41 is a riff which sounds very similar to one in the Hendrix 'Hey Joe' and the whole thing has a nice lazy feel to it, very enjoyable.

I see what you mean about the depth of sound on 'I can't explain', I'm sure you're right it's a combination of the lead and six string bass.

Have to say it's been very enjoyable sifting through youtube and wikipedia finding out more about these guys. How did we manage before!

Regards,
Tim.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Tim,

There is something else I had forgotten about until now. Junior Campbell strung his guitar with 4 plain strings and 2 wound strings. I asked him about it and he told me he used a light gauge 1st, a regular gauge 1st, a light gauge 2nd, a regular gauge 2nd, a regular gauge 4th and a regular gauge 6th. I think he said the strings were Clifford Essex, do you remember that name? I heard it mentioned by others many times over the years but never found a music shop in all that time that stocked them!
I also looked at the action on his Strat which was incredibly low, when they did a final local gig in my home town, which I think they got paid £70 for, this was just after they had made it big, and they still honoured the contract to do the gig which had been booked some time before.

Going back to left handed players, I had also forgotten to mention that the lead singer in my band is also left handed and plays guitar right handed, like I do.

Regards,
Charlie

[ha2he]

Hi Charlie,

I was aware of players using different gauge strings to meet their individual requirements whether that be a matter of tone or being able to bend strings more easily or a combination of both, from my limited knowledge of such things this does seem an unusual set to use though. Each to their own.

I have to admit I'd never heard of Clifford Essex before now, so the internet to the rescue, I've had a couple of different results from google about this but they both point in the same direction, if indeed this is the same Clifford Essex you mention it would appear they are an English company to do with banjo manufacture, one result informed me they are about to re-open some time in 2009, however I can not now find that link, tell a lie here it is:-

cliffordessexmusicco.com/

I know which instrument I'd rather carry to gigs ;D

Isn't it strange how we take notice of players set ups on their guitars, and wonder as I have how that affects the sound they create or maybe the playability. I once believed that a low set up was important as this would increase the speed of my playing which to some extent is true. To this end I set up a Strat as low as I could get it (7.25 radius neck) and while great for skipping between notes was useless for bending notes particularly higher up the neck as the notes would choke out or I'd get tangled under the adjacent string. I now understand this was due to the neck radius and that if you want low and fast 12 or 16 is the way to go.
I now set the neck relief to the specified for the radius ( I have two, a 7.25 and a 9.5 ) and adjust the string height by feel, it's a compromise between being low and being able to bend the strings.
I'm happy with it and that's what counts.

I doubt these days a band would be willing to fulfill a prior agreement unless it was advantageous to the media machine behind them, those were indeed the days Charlie.

Left handedness:- I'd totally forgotten this until now, when younger if I had to hold a bat or club I would always hold it incorrectly, being a righty I would hold it as a lefty. This is difficult to explain but I'll have a go.
The standard routine for a cricket bat if playing right handed is to place your right hand below your left hand, likewise for a golf club, I would always do it the other way round only to be told I was doing it wrong. Nowt so strange as folk!

Regards,
Tim.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Tim,

For a long time I have tended to use string gauges that suit me regardless of what others use. For some time around the 70's I was using a 9's set but with a 015 3rd instead of a 016 as I found it gave me better string balance on the Strat I played at the time. Even now I use basically a 10's set but with a thinner 2nd and 3rd. I have found that 010 is the thinnest I would want to have for the 1st string as the sound is considerably weaker with a 009.

I never did look into Clifford Essex until now so I knew nothing about them other than being told about strings so I didn't know they had stopped trading and were starting up again. I can be fairly sure that it will be connected with the same company, or perhaps the name only was bought because I see that the new registered office is in Norwich.

I have been told and had heard many times that a higher action gives a better sound and I can see how that is generally true but it doesn't work for me because I have small hands. I think each player should set their guitar to suit their own style.
I have mentioned before that I briefly played one of Hank's Strats and could hardly play it as the action was higher than I could have imagined, even after knowing that he didn't have a low action. It's no use having a good sound if you can't play!
There is a way of getting a lower action with a vintage radius and it is done by taking more off the middle part of the higher frets from around the 12th fret to the highest fret. The general pattern is to work in a V shape in that area. This gives a kind of compound radius and it does work. I always have my Strats set up this way and have always done this myself. Having too large a neck relief also causes choking of higher bent notes. I have some neck relief but not quite as much as some recommend. I have always preferred the feel of a vintage radius and by setting my guitars up this way I can enjoy some of the benefits of both a smaller and larger radius. Some builders make a compound radius neck that has a vintage radius at the lower notes and a modern radius at the higher end of the neck.

I'm not much of a sports person but when I played cricket or golf I always held the bat or club as a right handed person would.

Regards,
Charlie

[ha2he]

Hi Charlie,

I totally agree with you as regard to string gauge, I use what I'm happy with, which is now a 10-46 set, recently a Fender 150 pure nickel which I like the tone of, although previously I used GHS Boomers in the same gauge which I also like the tone of but for a different reason, the Fenders seem to have a more vintage Strat tone, whereas the GHS seem slightly brighter and appear to last for ever. With either set I find my third 'G' string seems slightly more powerful than I would like but not enough to buy one of a smaller gauge so it's obviously not that important to me.

I have to say I can't see how a higher action will give a better sou
nd, please take note of the phrase 'I can't see', I have found out that pickup height is important and half a turn on the adjustment screws can make a difference, I've found mine work well further away from the strings, I have Bareknuckle Apaches & CS 69's which are fairly low output.

When you mention taking the middle part of the fret off I assume you mean lowering the height of the fret in that area ? I can see how that would work but it must be difficult to achieve. I believe Warmoth make compound radius necks and I'm sure others do too.

As with all of this, eventually you'll end up with something that feels comfortable to you and you are happy with, if it just happens to be the way someone you admire sets his up, then obviously you both reached the same conclusions.

Regards,
Tim.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Tim,
Yes, pickups always have to be adjusted again after setting a different action. The bridge pickup will need the most adjustment, and the neck pickup the least. I have found that the heights required seems to vary from guitar to guitar, even if the strings and pickups and set up are the same. It could have to do with the way certain notes or harmonics react with different woods among other things.
A higher action is supposed to give a better sound as it allows the string to vibrate freely. It must all depend on the player's preference as a guitar that is hard to play will not sound good anyway.
You are correct about lowering the height of the frets. I have done it a number of times on different guitars and it has always made an improvement. It is tricky to do but I have done it several times. The hardest part is re-profiling the frets afterwards.

Regards,
Charlie

[kipper]

hi tim it is an intresting subject, i play right handed. but i often wonder when we all start out playing guitar, football, cricket ect, before we all get influenced by coaches, teachers trainer parents ect, told which hand to use. what path we would take reguards left hand or right or both. i remember always being told to use my right hand so i always did. it was only as i got older i found out there could be a different way. in the other thread when this was discussed i did say how i played golf left handed cricket lefty, tennis and squash both hands right being stronger in tennis and squash, football both feet.( dancing 2 left feet). but this was only when i was older and had more convidense to try other ways. what really made me try a different way was when i started to use a 12 bore shotgun in my early teens, we all have a leading eye i`m told, and mine was the left one, meaning really that i should shoot of my left shoulder. it was to dear to get a lefty so i worked around it. i had a mate at school who always hit over the knuckles with a thick ruler when he used his left hand for writing, the result being a total mess no one could read. my grandad used both his hands really well and i have a daughter who is lefty and a grandaughter who is a lefty we just let them do what they felt was best. but i think coaches, trainers, teachers, today are taught to look out for this today. peter

[ha2he]

Hi Peter,

How right you are about being influenced or taught to do things a certain way, the handwriting comes to mind. When it came time to switch schools after the eleven plus, three or four of us ended up in the same school in the same class, it was mentioned on more than one occasion by some of the teachers that they could tell we had come from the same school because of the way our handwriting was, virtually identical. The ruler on the knuckles for not conforming made sure of that.
Despite their best efforts being told what to think, I learned to think!

Luckily I believe those days are now long gone and we can flourish as individuals.

Regards,
Tim.

[BarryH]

With the arrival to prominence of Barack Obama, the BBCs One Show did a piece on lefties tonight and quite good it was too.

They opened by listing such great names as Einstein, Churchill, Ghandi, Da Vinchi, Kings, Queens various Presidents of the USA, the first men on the Moon and countless others who were left handed. They also stated that there is an estimated 15% of the UKs population that are left handed. This increase, they believe is due to allowing children to use their left hand if they choose to.

The latin word for left, according to the One Show is SINISTRA, and that was the main reason as children, a lot of kids, me included had our left hands tied behind our backs at school. Being left handed is still outlawed by some cultures even today.

In his book, Chris McManus of University College London argues that the proportion of left-handers is rising and left-handed people as a group have historically produced an above-average quota of high achievers. He says that left-handers' brains are structured differently in a way that widens their range of abilities, and the genes that determine left-handedness also govern development of the language centres of the brain.

It should also be noted that William Bonney (Billy The Kid) and Jack the Ripper where also lefties, but I'll keep quiet about them

Cheers
Barry