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Post by Tone on Mar 6, 2014 11:15:09 GMT
Hi all
I've always been a Vox amp man so have only taken a passing interest in Fender amps. However, at a club meeting this week our lead guitars were played through an oldish Fender Twin Reverb and I was gobsmacked by its lovely warm yet sparkly clean sound. So much so that the GAS is on the verge of kicking in!
The drawbacks for me are a) the price (around £1200 new or £700/800 used)and b)they are pretty powerful and so using it at home would be a case of overkill. Also,I know that these amps have been around for years in various guises so there may be differences in sound beween the different incarnations.
I'm sure that many of you guys out there have used or are using Fender amps so your observations will be most welcome. Is there a smaller and cheaper amp in the Fender range which will give the same sound?
Cheers.
Tony
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Post by shadfan4 on Mar 6, 2014 11:47:01 GMT
I had 1976 Twin Reverb with JBL's (Orange Baskets) from new, and sold it a year or so ago now, this was the loudest, cleanest, plenty of headroom amp you could ever want. BUT for home use no way, with a 100w's and weighing a ton, it had to go, as I didn't use it anymore. But for gigging great, if your back can stand the strain Mike. PS: I am keeping my little Fender Sidekick Reverb 25w as it's a great little amp.
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Post by sonovagun on Mar 6, 2014 12:01:12 GMT
Yes, I have found the sound especialy on the older Fender amps that don't feature a MV to have a better tonal system than the Vox amps. For home use the 15 watt blues jnr seem to be popoular choice altho I read that some people change the preamp valves to those of a lower power so that distortion doesn't set in too early. I always found that amps with a MV always gave a hint of overdrive at virtualy any setting but at the time I never knew of that option. An older valve Champ might be a good bet.
Best Keith
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Post by Charlie Hall on Mar 6, 2014 12:34:07 GMT
Hi Tony, I have used Twin Reverbs on and off for years. There are certainly several circuit variations but I think the biggest variation with them is with the speakers type and condition. Fender fitted many different types to Twin Reverbs over the years. Try to find out what speakers are fitted in that particular amp. If they are Fender labelled speakers try to find the manufacturers code which should be printed on the basket edge. I don't remember all the codes but I think Eminence is 67, Oxford is 465, Jensen is 220, Pyle is 1198. There are others that Fender has used, including the JBL D120F (alnico) which was a customer option. The JBL option gives arguably the best clean sound. However, I like the Eminence made Jensen repros that are in my Twin Reverb reissue. The problem with the reissues is that the printed circuit board is too good, technically, in my opinion. The hand wired fibre board in the older models have a warmer sound because of losses with that type of board and layout. I ended up removing the reverb recovery 10pf capacitor that is in parallel with a 3.3 meg resistor to tame down the excessive highs in the vibrato channel. I didn't use the amp for years because of this icepick sound. This capacitor is critical for adjusting the highs with the vibrato channel on these amps. I also changed the first filter capacitors that were 220uF to as near as I could get to the original lower value of 70uF. I fitted 80uF. This took away a lot of the sterile tone and made it sound more like the older 60s Twin Reverbs. With a few other simple mods the amp sounds wonderful now. The current reissues use Jensen C12K speakers but not everyone likes the sound. I haven't tried an amp with those fitted, but my guess is that the dull sound they are known to produce balances out with the excess highs I mentioned above. I don't think there is a Fender amp that will give quite the same sound at lower volumes. There are many that have their own special sound though. The Deluxe Reverb reissue is well liked, but the biggest complaint is with excess brightness. I think the current models use the same Jensen C12K as the Twin Reverb reissue. Some players have fitted the Eminence Cannabis Rex and love the results. I have that speaker in another Fender amp and I like it a lot. I would recommend only buying any Fender amp after trying it first, preferably with a short home trial if possible. Regards, Charlie
Edit: I got the Pyle speaker code wrong, it should be 1098.
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Post by murraysanders on Mar 6, 2014 23:29:44 GMT
Hello , I bought a New Fender Deluxe Reverb about 6 months ago it's 22 watts with a Celestiion Blue and 2 6V6 output tubes ( picture in my avatar) I've probably done about 25 gigs with it and it keeps up with a large PA without miking , It's a loud amp on 5 but can be toned down for home , I was playing through the PA for about 3 years as I had a lot of trouble with amps and the old Mesa MK3 was just to loud and Fender amps were blowing up on me , This little Deluxe is very light , loud , and one of the nicest sounding amps that I have ever played through , and fits behind the seat of my car with the seat pushed right back , Oh I saw the Searchers a couple of nights ago in Sale Victoria they were using Fender Twin Reverbs I think they were Hired from Billy Hyde in Sydney , Let me say they had one of the best sounds that I have ever heard , I saw them in 1966 when they toured with the Stones they were very good then and only have improved with age. Got off the track there but the Deluxe is a keeper and touch wood I hope it keeps going without problems . regards Murray.
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Post by somebodyelseuk on Mar 7, 2014 9:19:02 GMT
Hiya. Amps are as much a personal thing as guitars. I love Boogies, which to be honest were originally based on the Fender Bassman, anyway. I can't get on with Vox ACs, but I quite like the Matchless... My Dad has used a Fender amp for the past 20 years in preference to an old AC30 he had. Like guitars, you have to go into the shop and try 'em out, and at the volume you usually will be playing at. Cheers, Julian
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Post by Charlie Hall on Mar 7, 2014 10:53:15 GMT
I know the Fender and Mk circuits and I don't see anything that looks like a Bassman in the Mk circuits. It's a myth. Regards, Charlie
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Post by rogera on Mar 7, 2014 11:17:30 GMT
The amp that I use frequently at our Exeter Club is a Fender Tremolux narrow panel.
I made it myself and it's a cloned copy of a late '50s Tremolux.
It's a simple circuit with just one tone control but I find it terrific for the early Shads sound.
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Post by Tone on Mar 7, 2014 11:19:29 GMT
Many thanks to everyone for their input, particularly Charlie for his comprehensive assessment.
By coincidence, I played through another Fender last night. It was an old Vibrolux and also sounded very good indeed.
Plenty of food for thought here!
Cheers.
Tony
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Post by Charlie Hall on Mar 7, 2014 11:22:49 GMT
Hi Tony, Was it a black or silver face Vibrolux Reverb? Excellent amps with 2 X 10" speakers. It's a pity the current Custom Vibrolux reverb is not at all the same amp. Regards, Charlie
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Post by Tone on Mar 7, 2014 11:34:25 GMT
Hi Charlie
Neither!The cabinet was brown with fawn cloth over the speakers. Would that make it some sort of special edition?
Cheers.
Tony
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Post by Charlie Hall on Mar 7, 2014 16:52:08 GMT
Hi Tony, No, it would have been one of the usual brown series of models in the early 60s. Probably known as the 6G11. Apparently the only model in the range with a single 12" speaker. They came with a 30 watt or 40 watt Oxford speaker. I read that the 30 watt speakers did not handle the amp's power well. Probably why they changed to a 40 watt speaker. The Vibroverb brown reissue is probably the nearest thing Fender have made more recently, but the 10" Oxford speakers they used in the reissue are probably not as good sounding as the early 60s Oxfords. Also the reissue has a solid state rectifier, so not exact to an original in that respect either. I have played through a reissue and I thought it sounded OK but a bit lacking in high end sparkle or "air". Regards, Charlie
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Post by Stu's Dad on Mar 9, 2014 21:35:39 GMT
Hi Tony,
I don't know how much power you're looking for, but early 'Made in USA' Fender Pro Junior's a little beauty. Only 15 watts, but it's seriously loud when you need it to be. I've got one, and so have a few other members here. If you look back through the sound files you can see Jim (Oldfart) playing several numbers at home and one at the North Notts Shadows Club.
Regards, Len
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Post by Tone on Mar 14, 2014 22:57:17 GMT
Hi Charlie and Len
Apologies for the delay in responding to your comments. My phone line (along with most others in my area) and hence Internet access went down last Friday evening and it's only just come back on. And, being of the older generation, I find using my iPhone for the Net to be extremely laborious so I use it only when really necessary.
Things have moved quickly this week. My friend with the Vibrolux I referred to in my last post casually mentioned that he had a Fender Twin he might be willing to sell. He has a real Aladdin's cave of guitars amps etc in a room above his garage, many of them quite exotic and this Fender Twin had been gathering dust, unused, in there since he acquired it new about 10 years ago. I tried it, loved the sound and bought it, despite my reservations about it being too big for home use and too heavy to carry. I convinced myself that I won't have to worry about the weight because it will rarely, if ever, leave the house and it gives a great sound at low volumes. Anyway,there's a switch on the back which cuts the output from 100w to 25w.
From the limited amount of research I've been able to do I'm a little confused about these amps as there seems to have been many variations over the years. For example, the logo on the front panel of the one I've bought and the manual say simply "Twin Amp" and not "Twin Reverb" although it does have a reverb unit (but not tremolo which I believe some models have). Also, it has clean and dirty switchable channels and there's a further variation on the clean channel - pulling the volume knob brings in what Fender call the "Vintage Drive Sound" which adds variable "edge." It's like having a third channel. It's clearly a very versatile amp and I'm still finding my way around it but getting a very pleasing sound to my Hank attuned ears is easily obtainable.
Now thatI've got proper Internet access back I'll do some more research into what I've bought but if anyone (particularly you, Charlie, as you are clearly very well up on Fender amps) has any more information that would be great.
Cheers.
Tony
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Post by Charlie Hall on Mar 15, 2014 3:34:53 GMT
Hi Tony, After the last of the original series of Twin Reverb amps, Fender did the Twin II in the early 80s, then the red knob Twin in the late 80s, then a very similar model to the red knob Twin but with black knobs, then I think there have been two more Twin versions since that, and I think yours will be one of those two. I am not sure at the moment how these last two differ. Maybe they have a different number of knobs on the front panel. If you have a look at the latest Twin on the Fender site you should see if it is the same as yours or not. If not, then you probably have the previous one. The only Twin Reverbs made since the originals, as far as I know, have been the 65 Twin Reverb reissues. There have been some variations of the reissue too. I have heard of a limited edition model in blond, and a similar model (with a different name) with a 15" speaker. Regards, Charlie
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Post by murraysanders on Mar 15, 2014 8:13:21 GMT
Hello Tony it sounds like you have an Evil Twin , they are a very nice sounding amp , they are considered a pro amp although they do not have a vibrato channel fenders sales adds said they had a tremelo channel but I could never find it , the 2 channels are switchable between clean and drive and sound extra nice on 25 watts , If you want to know when it was made or any other details there is experts on the Fender Blackface page on Facebook , hope that helps best regards Murray.
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Post by Tone on Mar 15, 2014 13:06:38 GMT
Hi Charlie and Murray
Thanks for your further input and after a bit more research I have (I think) identified my amp although, from the various forums I've looked at, there does seem to be quite a lot of confusion about the Twin range
The spec of mine corresponds exactly to the model sometimes known unofficially as the "94 Twin" which was produced from 1994 to 2001 (the date code on mine indicates 2001 so it must have been one of the last made). It is indeed sometimes also known as the "Evil Twin" (what a great name for a very loud amp!) but that's erroneous or misleading because "Evil Twin" usually refers to a quite different model, normally the one with red knobs.
It's all very interesting but, irrespective of the history,I think it has a wonderful sound.
Cheers.
Tony
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2014 14:40:47 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2014 19:17:46 GMT
I have been looking online at the Fender Mustang V Head V.2. It seems a lot of amp for the money, around £250. Any thoughts ? Also Fender Super Champ X2 valve head. Duncan.
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Post by mojolomjl on Mar 28, 2014 19:27:00 GMT
Hi Duncan,
Don't know about the Fender Mustang V Head V.2. as I have a FM65DSP which is not too heavy and has plenty of volume and to my ears gives a pleasant tone. I have used it in a medium sized hall without problems. It cost about £200.00 about five years ago so they should be a lot cheaper ( used ) by now.
Best regards,
Maurice.
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