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Post by spikestevens on Jan 10, 2010 14:05:32 GMT
Is it just me or does anybody else invariably have to do a bit of tweaking after tuning up with these things?
I find I get every string perfectly in tune, but when I play an open chord for example, I usually have to do a bit of re-tuning to get it to sound right. It's not a question of the intonation being out, or anything - I check that constantly, but it just seems that however precise these digital tuners are I always have to adjust things slightly for it to sound acceptable.
Of course, the older ones like myself will remember the days of having to tune up with a blues harp (harmonica) or even an old set of pitch pipes, and I for one am glad I don't have to go down that route anymore.
Maybe it's because these digital tuners are too precise?
Who knows.
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jan 10, 2010 14:12:55 GMT
Hi Spike, It could be because the nut slots are too high. If your tuner is a chromatic one, check the tuning of each string at the first fret immediately after tuning up, then the second fret and so on, any string that shows an improvement as you go up the board has probably got a slot too high. To do this test, you mustn't press down too hard behind the frets. Regards, Charlie
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Post by spikestevens on Jan 10, 2010 15:23:06 GMT
Hya Charlie.
Yeah, you could be right. But it's not as if the strings are noticeably out, in fact nobody else has noticed it when I've mentioned it to them. Perhaps a lot of it is also the way I press my fingers on the frets. I get the guitar tuned up perfectly but when I play an F chord, for example, the A note on the 2nd fret might be just a touch sharp. As I say, not noticeably sharp, but I hear it.
It could all be psychological because it doesn't register on the tuner iteslf that anything's amiss.
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jan 10, 2010 15:50:16 GMT
Hi Spike, If the nut slot is out on the G string then the Ab note with an E chord would be even worse. Regards, Charlie
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Post by Tone on Jan 10, 2010 16:03:14 GMT
Hi
On the subject of tuning could someone explain why, when checking intonation, the gurus say you should check the tuning at the 12th fret by playing the harmonic, not the fretted note?
Cheers.
Tony
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jan 10, 2010 16:38:15 GMT
Hi Tony, You play the harmonic and the fretted note at the 12th fret and compare the pitch. You can't tell if the intonation is correct from just one or the other. Regards, Charlie
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Post by spikestevens on Jan 10, 2010 16:53:08 GMT
Thanks Charlie. I'm beginning to think it may well be the nut slot on the G that is causing the problem. This is the only string that consistently goes out - albeit only slightly. I tend to notice these things once I've recorded something. I play it back and I'm full of criticism of my work ("I'm sure that G string is out of tune, etc!").
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Post by Tone on Jan 10, 2010 17:03:31 GMT
Thanks, Charlie. All is now clear!
Cheers.
tony
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Post by shadowhankron on Jan 10, 2010 23:24:24 GMT
Hi
I use the Tuner on the Zoom G2.1 Effects Pedal would that be rated okay for Correct String Tuner..
regards
Ronnie
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jan 11, 2010 0:32:45 GMT
Hi Ronnie, I haven't tried the G2 tuner myself but it should be good enough for general tuning, not sure if it is good enough for checking intonation but it might be. Maybe others who have used it will let us know. Regards, Charlie
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Post by grip on Jan 11, 2010 3:10:25 GMT
Hi Charlie,
The G2 tuner is not really sensitive enough for intonation, I checked it against my M13 and Fender Tuners, it will show as being "in tune" but the margin of error is noticable on both other devices (which "agreed" with each other).
Kind regards,
Chris
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jan 11, 2010 10:19:51 GMT
Hi Chris, Thanks for that, now we know! Regards, Charlie
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Post by graeme on Jan 11, 2010 11:14:16 GMT
The real reason the guitar sounds out of tune, even after careful use of an electronic tuner, is because it *is* out of tune. As with a piano, you need to slightly tune/detune notes in order to achieve something close to equal temperence, this is known as 'stretch' tuning. Over the years, several alternate fretting systems have been proposed. One of the most interesting (and somewhat ambitious, not to say expensive) can be found here - www.truetemperament.com/site/index.php . Their FAQ page will tell you *why* the guitar is not in tune, so there's no point in my repeating it here. Another site worth looking at is - www.guyguitars.com/eng/handbook/Tuning/tuning.html#stretch - which covers various stretch tuning methods for the guitar.
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Post by santoinetwo on Jan 11, 2010 13:24:35 GMT
I have found in the past that if two guitarists use a chorus effect, you can get an out of phase type of sound, leading to one sounding out of tune with the other. I use a boss chromatic Tuner to check guitars intonation, Then Korg rack tuner in my main rack, these are great as you can check you're tuning while playing ! Like any guitar if it is set up correctly, it's tuning should remain very stable.
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Post by shadowhankron on Jan 11, 2010 16:53:39 GMT
Thanks Everyone for your Replies.
regards
Ronnie
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Post by graeme on Jan 12, 2010 8:10:10 GMT
.... any guitar if it is set up correctly, it's tuning should remain very stable. But not accurate - see my last post.
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Post by 5tratocaster on Jan 12, 2010 19:17:48 GMT
You need to check the accuracy specification of the tuner you are using. Some, like the renowned Boss TU-2 tuner pedal or the equally expensive Planet Waves Chromatic Tuner Pedal CT-04 are only accurate to + or - 3 cents, but the human ear can normally detect accuracy down to 1 cent, so with these, you would expect them to get you in tune roughly, then you would have to fine tune by ear. I have found by experience that tuners built in to other effects pedals, like the Zoom G7.1ut and the Yamaha Magicstomp are also not very precise. They are accurate, but I can turn the tuning key up or down and hear a difference in pitch whilst the green light remains lit on the tuner telling me that the note is still correct, so they have a wide tolerance. Super-accurate strobe tuners are available that will go to 0.01 cent accuracy, but that's probably going too far for a guitar as you'd never get the strobe to settle. Accuracy between 0.1 and 0.5 cents would seem to be the ideal. Some of the cheaper headstock tuners that work on the vibration principle are actually quite accurate. I have a Crafter TG-200H that I find very good. Geoff
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