Fender Classic 60s player

[les]

Is there any reason for me not to go ahead & purchase a Fender classic 60s player, ................ complete with GREY bobbins,Not sure what difference GREY bobbins make though.I will probably need to wire the vacant tab on the switch to the neck pick-up tone control in anticipation of needing to slightly calm the expected shrillness of the bridge pick-up. ........ Is it ok to do that ?
........... Or will it be the American standard or Deluxe ?
Best wishes, Les.

[petercreasey]

Hiya Les,
I have a 50's classic player and love it to bits, I think it's always a good thing to have a tone control on the bridge ( can't have pickups without tone controls in my view, whatever the strat)
if it's any help you can find a wiring diagram here www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=tone_f_bp

[les]

Hi Peter,Thankyou for your comment & the very useful wiring diagram. I generally knock the volume back a notch or two and this helps take any edge out of the sound on my L P but i think to be able to wire the bridge pick-up as the diagram will Quell my fears of purchasing a strat.Best wishes, Les.

[jase]

Hi Les

I can't offer any reason not to have a Classic 60's. I tried out as many models as I could early this year purely to play Shads music on. I took my zoom pedal along and tried a Classic 50's players, a Classic 60's players, US standard and US Deluxe. I wanted to try out the Mexican deluxe but couldn't get one to try. I wouldn't say there was much between most of them apart from the US deluxe which I didn't think sounded very good into my Zoom. I ended up with a Squire Simon Neil as I didn't feel that either of the Classic players were that much better for the extra money. Its all about personal feel at the end of the day and I'm sure you will be very happy with a Classic 60's.

[les]

Hi Jase,We were all into the Simon Neal strat not long ago,Out of curiousity,I may well give the Simon Neal strat a run.Thankyou for your comment. Best wishes, Les.

[peterbower]

Jase

Like your self, I got myself down to a music shop, well several actually to try out the various Strats. I have to agree with you the Classic player Strats are brilliant as is the Squire Classic Vibe series which has to be the best value for money Strat produced by Fender.

Am I right, the Classic Player Strat has a 2 pivot point trem and the Classic 50 & 60's have a 6 screw vintage trem?

You know this forum is a great place for getting information but when it comes to choosing a guitar, you really need to try out the guitar in a shop or from a friend. The forum cannot give you the sound you are looking for well not that accurately and the forum can't give you the feel of the neck, how the pickups sound, how the trem feels or the guitars tactile feel. You can only settle all these questions by playing it. So my advice is, go down your guitar shop and play one.

Peter

[jase]

Peter

I never got to try the Mexican deluxe players Strat but I think its the regular 6 screws like both the 50's and 60's. I did try the latest US standard and also US Deluxe and they both had the 2 point trems.

[petercreasey]

The 50's Classic player has the 2 point trem The Classic 50's Strat has the 6 screw vintage trem
Hope this helps
Take care

[peterbower]

Thanks Jase & Peter

That confirms what I thought. I have since found out some more about the Mexican made instruments and the newer Chinese made Squires. Many of the parts are the same, namely the bridge/trem unit, most if not all of the electrics and in the case of the Mexican standard Strat, the necks.
I heard that Fender Mexico were supplying parts to Fender China.

Just digressing for a moment, I tried a brand new bog standard US Fender Strat the other day and it was pretty terrible, admittedly it needed a set up but it no way was going to give me that vintage twang.
Peter

[les]

............ So then,Which is the better system ? The two point pivot or the vintage six screw system ? .............. I have loads of PTFE tape at the ready for the trem arm thread & heavier tape if i need it. ............ ( Never touched my Les Paul in 32 years ! lol ) I think that L R BAGGS had a similar problem with his trem units.
Best wishes, Les.

[jase]

May 6, 2011 17:00:38 GMT @petercreasey said:

The 50's Classic player has the 2 point trem The Classic 50's Strat has the 6 screw vintage trem
Hope this helps
Take care

sorry for the wrong info.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Les,
The two point system floats more freely. it's technically better (except perhaps for maximum transfer of vibration) but can be a bit too sensitive for some players.
Regards,
Charlie

[les]

Hi Charlie,Thankyou. Best wishes, Les.

[peterbower]

Charlie

If I remember correctly, Hank said he didn't like the modern 2 pivot post trem for a couple of reasons, mainly though when he played muted notes the tuning would go 'sharp' when he rested his palm on it because it was too sensitive.

Arm wobble can be easily rectified permanently by fitting one of the excellent Celtrocka steel blocks, or if money is no object a Wilkinson with a torque screw adjustment. There are some excellent threads on this forum that dealt with this subject so its not worth saying much more here.

The only way you will see and feel the difference between a vintage 6 screw trem and a modern 2 pivot trem is to try them out in a shop or if a friend has both.

My mates Bigsby trem on his Les Paul was always playing up mainly not returning to pitch. He had it fixed, but not sure what the problem was.
Peter

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Peter,
Mark, our lead singer, had a Les Paul with a Bigsby added. I think there are two problems with that typical set up. The roller that the strings pass under between the tailpiece and the bridge causes more friction, and the bridge was fixed so not allowing it to rock back and forth with the tremolo action.
Regards,
Charlie

[les]

Hi members,I might have to look at some of the Trev wilkinson Guitars though the rather ugly scratchplates & Headstocks tend to put me off them but,with a good trem already installed, ....... and a couple of mini humbuckers, ............. Hmmm ! Best wishes, Les.

[TonyL]

Hi Les

If the scratch plates and headstock put you off have a look at the Vintage Reissued V6 series. I bought one at Christmas and am well pleased with it.

[les]

On second thoughts,It seems that the two point trem on the Classic 60s player can be easily shimmed to limit the trem travel,most of us i think,rarely if at all pull tremolo arms back to give a sharp sounds. Best wishes. Les.

[les]

Hi Tony, Thankyou for your information, ............. Im beginning to wonder wether we are being taken for a ride regarding expensive guitars ! Some of the Vintage V6 demo's that i have just listened to sound really good ! ....... The Vintage MSSB re issue seems to have quite some spec & reputation.Now what am i going to do ! Best wishes, Les.

[peterbower]

Hi Tony

The Vintage series do get a good right up, I do believe they are made in China, but I could be wrong. Trev Wilkinson had an input into the design and some of his budget end hardware is used in production.. Most of Trevs hardware is now made by Gotoh of Japan, but even that is now subbed out to China. Nothing wrong in any of that because currently some of the best guitars are coming out of Chine, namely the Squire classic series.

I was very fortunate years ago to do a bit of part time work with Trev Wilkinson when he was chief designer at Patrick Eggle guitars, and a good example of his work is the superb LA Classic which I have. This is why I always recommend his products because I'm biased and know a good product when I see one.

Trev Wilkinson's own company make 'high end' guitars under the name 'Fret King' and the Fender types have an odd shaped headstock. Trev told me it was to have some individuality and he did not want to produce yet another Fender clone.
The Corona 60 is £1600. so he is competing with the Fender custom shop.
Its interesting also to see that Trev calls Fiesta red Firenza red and on his Fret King Corona its Coral red.

Peter

[jase]

Hi Les
I forgot to mention when I was checking out Strat style guitars earlier in the year that I tried the G&L tribute S500 www.glguitars.com/tribute/instruments/S-500/index.asp. Made in the east with US parts they receive very good reviews. Its got a good trem system , there is no trem arm wobble or movement. The trem arm didn't suite me , but that is just personal preference. In the end the neck was not right for me but it might be worth a look.

[les]

Hi Jase,Thankyou for your information, ........... Thats something else i need to look into ! lol.
Well,Its the old story, ........... Am i going to be happy gigging with a guitar that for some reason i would almost expect something to be lacking somewhere, ........... Usually its sound that lets things down,Tho i can set almost anything up close to the standard of my Les Paul.
By contrast,My Les Paul has given me 32 years of trouble free gigging,So i have to ask myself, Is a budget priced guitar going to give me worry free operation on stage just when i need it to be good,
Or do i continue to go along the expensive route and almost be guaranteed good sound & operation.
Decisions eh. Best wishes, Les.

[Charlie Hall]

Hi Les,
I can almost guarantee that going the expensive route will not necessarily provide a better result, in fact it is often worse. Of course, it is just as easy to make a mistake with a cheaper instrument. I strongly advise you trying out any instrument you are thinking of before buying.
Regards,
Charlie

[peterbower]

Hi all and Jase

Charlie is right, try out the guitar before you buy. after all you wouldn't by a new car with out giving it a test drive first, and the expensive route is not always the best.

One of my favourite guitars was the Ernie Ball Music Man silhoette, if you can find one, now that I would pay money for.

Peter

[les]

Hi Charlie & members.Of course you are right with what you say regarding expensive & less expensive,I know that it doesnt always work like that,It seems that standards have changed very quickly & over a short period of time so of course the only way really is to be surrounded with a pile of all sorts of strats ! ( nice eh ? ) and possibly be pleasantly surprised,I wouldnt be too surprised the way things are going if a two for the price of a NORMAL Strat were possible. Thanks for some good info as usual members. Best wishes. Les.

[les]

Hi members,Well,I think that i might just go along the route of purchasing a Fender classic 60s player after all of this,And hope that it is a reasonable starting point as far as my re introduction to strats go,I will probably need to do a custom bend on the tremolo arm to fit snugly inside of my last two fingers,I just cant imagine why they turn them out at such a dopey angle ! but ! ............. I cant help wondering wether these pickups are the same that are installed in the Squire Simon Neal strat ! I have a feeling that there probably isnt much difference between them. Best wishes. Les.

[glyderslead]

Hi Les,

Having read all your postings you seem to be highly attached to your Les Paul. So I was wondering if you would be better off simply having your pickups swopped for mini humbuckers and add a stetsbar. Unlike bigsby's where friction can cause instability (noted above) these stay in tune as the whole bridge moves. It won't mark your guitar and can be removed later if you wish. That will give a change of tone and a tremolo. If you have any money left over perhaps also get a Simon Neil Strat, these sound very good by all accounts. Your only problem then will be hitting a "C" instead of a "D" on the new Strat due to the longer scale length...........!

Good wishes,

Mick

[les]

Hi Mick,Well i have been useing my Les Paul Deluxe constantly for the last 32 years, It has the mini humbuckers,I have had trouble free use from the Les,Just a clean during a string change is all i ever had to do.its played its magic everywhere so i am wondering why i would want to spend around £600 on a Fender classic player & still have to mod the pickups
& trem for around another £250.It doesnt make sense really to give myself more trouble when i didnt need to.The stetsbar would be the perfect cost effective solution but,The les is so heavy after a gig & i certainly know its been on my shoulder & its getting rather vintage now which wants to make me save further wear on it.
The strats definately have their own appealing palette of sounds ......... i really love the middle p / u sounds with a light hand mute & a light touch on the trem.
I have seen for sale a MIM 50s Re issue modded with kinman blues,wilkinson trem,uprated tuners & nut,The guy is asking around £550 for this guitar,Well he obviously knew full well the strat shortcomings and modded his strat accordingly,It seems that this is the way to go & i might buy the guitar off of him, .... if he still has it,This might well be the best way for me to go. Im still not sure of the Simon Neal strat,some members already change the blocks as soon as they get them & the pickups seem to be a yes or no issue so again,It might just be a smart move for me to purchase this guys modded strat as he obviously knows all of the shortcomings. Best wishes, Les.
( footnote ) ........ I think i will go with the Fender Classic 60s player after all as the 50s re issue's frets, radius, soft v shape neck are likely to not suit