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Post by kipper on Jun 19, 2011 13:49:16 GMT
hi all if i can drag you all away from naming charlies new box ;D
when nickel parts are refered to on the older guitars do they mean nickel plated or solid nickel.?? i have been told it does alter the tone a small bit . thanks peter
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jun 19, 2011 18:01:15 GMT
Hi Peter,
Everything I can think of that is referred to as nickel on guitars is actually nickel plated as far as I know.
Regards,
Charlie
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Post by kipper on Jun 19, 2011 18:30:37 GMT
thanks charlie, i have just been told all goldplated parts are nickel plated before the gold plating does on, so if you rub the gold off which is really thin you have a nickel plated part. peter
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Post by Charlie Hall on Jun 19, 2011 22:11:44 GMT
Hi Peter,
I didn't know all gold plated parts (as far as guitars are concerned, jewellery may be different due to EEC directives) were nickel underneath.
Regards,
Charlie
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Post by harley on Jun 19, 2011 22:25:26 GMT
Hi Peter
higher quality gold plated AND chrome plating in USUALLY nickel plated 1st however a lot of cheaper gold plated parts are most definately not. I remember a cheapish gold plated bridge i bought recently. after only a few weeks the gold plating had worn off revealing bare metal. so in that case not only was it plated straight onto bare metal, but also the plating was painfully thin. lesson learned for me.
regards
Ian
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Post by peterbower on Jun 20, 2011 7:06:03 GMT
When I blue print the trem top plate to the sustain block it involves rubbing the underside of the top plate on a plano parrallel block with various grades of wet and dry.
T
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Post by peterbower on Jun 20, 2011 7:15:54 GMT
Sorry about that , hit the wrong key.
The copper under under coat shows through on the better quality top plates.
Gold plating on the Fender custom shop guitars is a joke, its only about one micron, usually less, I had my parts gold plated to 5/7 microns by a local plater.
Nickel plating was an early engineering process to try and protect metal parts from corrosion. Its worked fairly well but chrome plating was better, invented for the same reason. Nickel by the way is pretty toxic stuff.
Peter
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Post by 26rednef on Jun 20, 2011 8:10:42 GMT
Hi.
The gold plate is thin because of the price of the metal and it is very thin, down to 20/30 nanometers and it will be warned out. For a good made gold plated guitar bridge it will be places where it is gone in a year or two if the guitar is daily used and it is not much to do about it. To buy parts in genuine gold will not be a option for most of us. But it should never fall off then it is just a very cheep gold paint, never on quality parts, mostly we will get what we pay for.
Kind Regards,
26rednef
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Post by DaveC on Jun 20, 2011 9:21:40 GMT
Hi Peter,
Good quality plating of a base metal with gold (or chrome) requires an under-layer to provide a smooth surface (smooth at the atomic level that is). Nickel makes an excellent under-layer and was widely used in gold plated jewellery until a few years ago. E.U. regulations eventually put a stop to this because a lot of people have a skin contact allergy to nickel. My wife is one of them and insists that I only buy solid gold and platinum for her!
Joking aside the allergic reaction is very common and can be quite severe. It manifests itself in surprising ways --- for instance my wife can't even touch my resonator guitar because it's nickel plated. She even gets a mild reaction from nickel-silver strings and once ended up looking like a panda after merely trying on a pair of sunglasses with gold-plated frames. Needless to say it isn't a joke to her.
To answer your original question, "nickel" guitar parts are obviously just nickel-plated. The steel (or brass) underneath provides the strength and rigidity: the nickel plating provides the smooth shiny surface which eventually tarnishes so attractively.
Regards
DaveC
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Post by peterbower on Jun 20, 2011 9:58:55 GMT
I wonder if there is a 'long term' health hazard with nickel or nickel plated guitar strings.
Peter
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Post by 26rednef on Jun 20, 2011 10:26:32 GMT
Hi.
There is always a risk with Nickel and it can make problems after may years of use, often when getting a wound in contact with the metal. Metal coins is one of the most troublesome things we get in contact with and almost every day, but this type of problems it is very individual. I have played for more then 50 years and always on Nickel wound strings, have had wounds on my fingertips caused by to much playing and so far no problems but it may be just luck.
It is well known that Louis Armstrong had huge problems with his lips because of Nickel allergy, he changed the block to silver but silver is not fully clean from Nickel, so he was never completely free from problems.
Kind Regards,
26rednef
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Post by peterbower on Jun 20, 2011 10:37:16 GMT
I'll have to do what Stevie Ray Vaughan did, super glue my finger tips. Only joking, but SRV did that because of finger damage from his very heavy strings.
Peter
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Post by kipper on Jun 20, 2011 16:33:49 GMT
thanks for all your replys very intresting reading. i was told about the nickel plating under gold plating when asking a shop if they had a nickel plated telecaster bridge, the bloke said they had none in stock but what he suggested as a get around was buy the gold one and rub it with metal polish and the gold plating would come off very easyly. that put me off gold plating, and then reading up on nickel plating i found it has been banned in sevral countrys now as being toxic so thats put me off that as well. we live and learn as they say. peter
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