|
Post by philc on Jan 25, 2020 9:26:53 GMT
I think the whole point of buying a Marvin would be to sound like the the original oldies, if it doesn't sound very similar then one there's no point in buying one?
Sorry but I can't help with pickup info.
Phil
|
|
|
Post by glyderslead on Jan 25, 2020 17:00:06 GMT
Hello Phil,
That argument applies even more to Fender. “ Perhaps the whole point of buying a Fender would be to sound like the original” .We have all been thrown off course by Fender at sometime or another - headstock changed, neck changed, 4 bolt to 3 bolt ( or is it screws) and back to 4, then it’s 3x single coils changed to.2 and a ‘bucker - not to mention all the variations of pickup windings they use and different sounds produced. The basic scratch plate 8 hole to 11 or whatever. Even the tremolo 6 screws to 2 screws. They have left many trying to find the right combination the sound of the originals.
At least with Burns they are much the same instrument Now as then on the face of it. Materials used has changed here and there. But other than that and the change of pickup sound, which Burns seems to have done purposely for their marketing beliefs, that is really all that’s changed. It’s a shame they don’t mention this type of thing in their marketing blurb or even offer the choice of original or new style pickups in their new instruments.
I wonder if Burns would or could make original sounding pickups now? If they could they may have a fairly large after market.
I don’t think the 2 files posted above represent the mainstream sound found in Flingle Bunt, which is what I suspect a lot of people would be aiming for and which can almost be found with some single coils be ithey Fender, Burns or another.
Of course I may well have this all wrong, in which case my mum would have described me as “daft but ’appy”.
Cheers
Mick
|
|
|
Post by glyderslead on Jan 25, 2020 17:02:34 GMT
Hello Phil,
That argument applies even more to Fender. “ Perhaps the whole point of buying a Fender would be to sound like the original” .We have all been thrown off course by Fender at sometime or another - headstock changed, neck changed, 4 bolt to 3 bolt ( or is it screws) and back to 4, then it’s 3x single coils changed to.2 and a ‘bucker - not to mention all the variations of pickup windings they use and different sounds produced. The basic scratch plate 8 hole to 11 or whatever. Even the tremolo 6 screws to 2 screws. They have left many trying to find the right combination to achieve the sound of the originals.
At least with Burns they are much the same instrument now as then on the face of it. Materials used has changed here and there. But other than that and the change of pickup sound, which Burns seems to have done purposely for their marketing beliefs, that is really all that’s changed. It’s a shame they don’t mention this type of thing in their marketing blurb or even offer the choice of original or new style pickups in their new instruments.
I wonder if Burns would or could make original sounding pickups now? If they could they may have a fairly large after market.
I don’t think the 2 files posted above represent the mainstream sound found in Flingle Bunt, which is what I suspect a lot of people would be aiming for and which can almost be found with some single coils be ithey Fender, Burns or another.
Of course I may well have this all wrong, in which case my mum would have described me as “daft but ’appy”.
Cheers
Mick
|
|
|
Post by philc on Jan 25, 2020 18:47:36 GMT
Hello Phil, I don’t think the 2 files posted above represent the mainstream sound found in Flingle Bunt, which is what I suspect a lot of people would be aiming for and which can almost be found with some single coils be ithey Fender, Burns or another. Cheers Mick Hi Mick, The two files I posted were practically dry, so that the sound of just the guitar could be heard, Flingel Bunt is in another ball park as Hank uses echo, also, the studio gets more involved, here's the same 64 Burns with FB and again, my BT. Phil app.box.com/s/rxkkevxtgfzhpbws1sdvl6jjr02yjq2c
|
|
|
Post by glyderslead on Jan 25, 2020 21:49:43 GMT
Hello Phil,
Thanks for that great recording . It certainly settles the “argument” and shows the great tone that can be achieved with the correct original vintage guitar and of course excellent playing skills. The guitar sound is amazingly similar to the original recording, but then that’s what you always do.
I guess myself as well as many others will just have to make do with what we have...............until, either Burns come up with a proper vintage pickup ...or Roger manages to find the formula and make one.
Cheers and best wishes
Mick
|
|
|
Post by philc on Jan 25, 2020 23:14:00 GMT
Thanks Mick, I wish I had a modern Burns so I could do a comparison!
Phil
|
|
|
Post by glyderslead on Jan 26, 2020 0:31:33 GMT
Hello Phil.
Hopefully someone who lives nearby will contact you and lend you theirs so you can do a comparison. Should no one contact you after a week or so, if you wish you can pm me and I will send you mine. Then we will all know where we stand.
Cheers
Mick
|
|
|
Post by philc on Jan 26, 2020 9:25:10 GMT
I don't know of anyone near me on this forum Mick, that is, knobody that has posted anyway Phil
|
|
|
Post by rogercook on Jan 26, 2020 9:40:10 GMT
|
|
|
Post by philc on Jan 26, 2020 10:22:15 GMT
The neck pickup on my 2004 is closest probably but it doesn't have that woody, nasal sound that yours has. Not quite the same for live work, but have you tried eqing with your DAW to get that nasal sound, as it seems like the engineers at AR might have enhanced this and possibly the REDD desk had something to do with it. Phil
|
|
|
Post by rogercook on Jan 26, 2020 11:23:53 GMT
I guess I'm aiming to achieve something like that Bossa Roo sound in a live setting, Phil. I have a 10 band graphic eq but the "woodiness" is the missing ingredient.
|
|
|
Post by peterbower on Jan 26, 2020 11:38:03 GMT
There was a guy up in Newcastle making retro fit burns type pickups but I have lost all details, apparently he made some for Brian May's home build guitar
|
|
|
Post by bor64 on Jan 26, 2020 11:50:14 GMT
I would do a recording of the five Marvin's if I had a decent recorder.... My recordings are always done on a recorder of a friend of mine and he behind it... I know I have to buy one someday If that guy is telling, he made some for Brian May original red special...he's full of it, what a BS! I've the book by Brian May about the red special and on that guitar are still the original untempered tri-sonics , he bought in London in the 60's Cheers Rob
|
|
|
Post by rogercook on Jan 26, 2020 13:21:31 GMT
Peter, I think that was the late Jim Cairnes, who I think may have been involved in winding pickups for Burns early on, so maybe he did make the ones in BMs guitar.
|
|
|
Post by philc on Jan 26, 2020 14:56:54 GMT
I guess I'm aiming to achieve something like that Bossa Roo sound in a live setting, Phil. I have a 10 band graphic eq but the "woodiness" is the missing ingredient. You should be able to get somewhere near the nasal tone with your G.EQ's mids, but what's needed is the guitars timbre to start with, if you want to record your guitar with as close as possible amp setting, I can try to eq it and let you have the settings? Phil
|
|
|
Post by rogercook on Jan 26, 2020 16:12:00 GMT
Thanks Phil. I'll do that but it may take a while as I'm not currently set up to record except for a rather basic DI.
|
|
|
Post by bor64 on Jan 26, 2020 20:32:46 GMT
If the late Jim Cairnes did some development for Tri-Sonic Burns pu's for the BM model.... These didn't end up for sure in the original red special of Brian, because in that guitar the original 60's Tri-Sonics are still in.
Cheers Rob
|
|
|
Post by peterbower on Jan 27, 2020 9:15:59 GMT
Thank's Roger, I wasn't aware Jim Cairns had passed on, Yes, got it wrong with the original pups in the BM red special, but BS is a bit strong, its a bit off topic now
|
|
|
Post by philc on Jan 27, 2020 10:25:57 GMT
|
|
|
Post by peterbower on Jan 27, 2020 10:48:11 GMT
Thanks for posting that philc, very interesting, What pickups did the Guild signature guitar have
|
|
|
Post by bor64 on Jan 27, 2020 16:47:01 GMT
Seymour Duncan wrote on his website as answer on a question, if he could make BM pu's.... That he's the one, who made the ones in the Guild BM guitar.
Cheers Rob
|
|
|
Post by claptone on Jan 31, 2020 10:41:26 GMT
Hi all!
I'm from Finland and it's my first reply. I have been The Shadows fan since 1980 and I bought my first strat eight years later (1987 Squier E01 series). As I turned 50 in 2016 I got Burns Marvin as new and it was the last one from that batch. I have tought it is chinese made and assembled in UK, but as I read this post, I'm not sure anymore. The neck plate says: 'The Legend 1964 Custom'. It's sound is not like a strat sound (I use Vox AC15-c2 tb-channel), the text in a tremolo plate is engraved, not stamped and I would say the build quality is excellent compared to my Strats (1989 AVRI '62, 2017 FSR Classic 50's and 1987 Squier). The tremolo arm is not lose after three year use and the fretboard edges are so smooth.
Mika
|
|
|
Post by bor64 on Feb 1, 2020 10:34:45 GMT
Hi Mika, Welcome to this fantastic Hank&Shadows and other guitar sounds Looney Bin! To be honest Burns owner Barry Gibson is very inventive with the script/engravings on neck plates.... I've seen The Legend, The Marvin 1964,Shadows Custom, The Shadows Custom Edition etc so now I can add a new one The Legend 1964 Custom. I've seen Marvin type guitars with plastic in white,black,pearl and a combo of all three on the same guitar. Also without the plastic surrounding of the Rez-O-Tube plate.... It looks to me, as a kinda scrapping the barrel with parts and make guitars with what's left in the bin. One thing is sure if a Burns is made in England it's engraved Made In England on the neck plate... A engraved Rez-O-Tube plates has sharp edged script....a stamped one by a large heavy press has slightly raised edge in compare with the flat surface of the plate. You can spot it by eye and feel it on close inspection. Furthermore the China 2004 and 1964 series Rez-o-Tube plates are painted in aluminium colour and feel glassy... Hope this helps. Cheers Rob
|
|
|
Post by philc on Feb 1, 2020 15:32:07 GMT
|
|
|
Post by claptone on Feb 1, 2020 16:20:37 GMT
Thank you Rob!
Yes, that helped. So, after all, it is made in China and assembled in the UK as I first tought, but anyway, I'm very pleased with the build quality. The text of the Rez-O-Tube plate feels like there would be a groove, but maybe it is stamped then. The guitar by the way, is white with tortoise plastics in front and the tremolo back cover plate is black. Text in pickup covers is engraved.
Mika
|
|
|
Post by bor64 on Feb 2, 2020 14:03:23 GMT
YVW Mika, A picture or two of your guitar would be nice...and make things easier to judge. It sounds your guitar is a copy of a 64/65 Marvin like the one on Phil's pictures. Phil's backplate is tortoise because they ran apparently out of black plate which is solid black and painted white in the engravings and on the sides. Common practise at Burns in the 60's....Phil's Rez-O-Tube anchor bar is fasten with single slot screw instead of cross-heads. My 65 has all single slot head screws except on the anchor bar and the toast rack... Paul Day (guitar guru and author of the Burns book)told me common practise at Burns. When they ran out of something a "office-boy" was send to the local hardware store and the only thing what matters "is the screw the same size"... In the 60's cross heads (although invented more then 40 years earlier) where not commonly available in large numbers. You wrote, you feel a grove. The pressed China one has that too, but the edge of the script groove is slightly raised on the edge of the plate surface. When the tons of weight stances the script in the plate, something gonna give... Assembled in GB is just mounting the engraved neck-plate with serial number in case a China made guitar. So please tell us more about your guitar has it COA and was it a higher prices guitar etc... Cheers Rob
|
|
|
Post by philc on Feb 2, 2020 16:20:43 GMT
Just some more observations, the temolo arm on my 64 has a smooth S shape with perfect curves, with the 2004/Legend the curves are not the same, more abrupt. My picture shows a replica arm which came with the guitar, it has a different shape and the black plastic handle is shorter, I don't know what make it is? Phil PS An interesting price on this one! www.premierguitars.com.au/product/vintage-original-burns-marvin-uk-1964/
|
|
|
Post by claptone on Feb 2, 2020 18:08:45 GMT
I ordered my Marvin from Burns and it was one of their custom elite guitars (no longer available). Next there was again the 'Marvin Signature Limited Edition' - model. I think mine is the same but without Hank Marvin's signature. The price was about 1500 £ and it has COA - it is made 28.7.2016. Thank you Phil! Mika
|
|
|
Post by philc on Feb 2, 2020 18:12:54 GMT
You have to upload pictures to something like IMGBB and then copy the "BBCode Full" and paste it here.
|
|
|
Post by rogercook on Feb 2, 2020 19:14:58 GMT
Low E and A poles look lower on Mika's than Phil's
|
|